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The issue I raised is about "symbol" vs. "symbolist."
N

On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 4:46 PM, Chanan Mittal <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> "Neither flesh nor fleshless"
>
> "concentration / Without elimination"
>
> No, it does not exclude anything. It includes the physical as well as the
> metaphysical. Only it does not exclude the ultimate, the permanent, the
> Absolute. It adds something to, and thus enriches, our experience of this
> world.
>
> *Who is the third who walks always beside you? *
> *When I count, there are only you and I together *
> *But when I look ahead up the white road *
> *There is always another one walking beside you *
> *Gliding wrapt in a brown mantle, hooded *
> *I do not know whether a man or a woman *
> *—But who is that on the other side of you? *
>
> CR
>
> On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 1:12 PM Nancy Gish <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> The issue here is, as you note, what one means by "symbolic." Hughes
>> seems to think it is the same as "symbolist" in the notion of being a
>> gateway to a spiritual world outside physical reality. That would seem to
>> cut out a great deal of poetry--like imagism, or WCW or Levertov or any
>> poet who saw or sees poems as ways to engage with the material world
>> directly.
>>
>> Otherwise, as you say, it is just a tautology.
>> Nancy
>>
>> On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 1:07 PM, Carrol Cox <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> "Because poetry is fundamentally symbolic in its form, it possesses the
>> capacity to suggest the incommensurable and unknowable of the
>> transcendence
>> and thereby reawaken the spiritual experiences that gave rise to the
>> symbols
>> and stories of poetry in the first place."
>>
>> This is an odd proposition. Classified ads are fundamentally symbolic.
>> Porn
>> videos on YouTube  are fundamentally symbolic. Coffee-shop chatter is
>> fundamentally symbolic. Nothing in particular follows from the tautology
>> that poetry is symbolic.
>>
>> The portentousness of the mere word, "symbol," is itself a bit odd.
>>
>> And what is the difference between "poetry is symbolic" and "poetry is
>> fundamentally symbolic in its form"?
>>
>> Carrol
>>
>>
>>