Thanks Nancy,

do you think Mr Bennett and Wickham have found themselves in a similar situation to the women?  

And while I grant you Elizabeth does have the good works of Darcy to justify her changed response to him I wonder how much she is " lucky or the right sort" and how much is more active than that.

Austen represents her as a robust intellect with a strong sense of propriety but Elizabeth quite astutely notes that to be mistress of Pemberley would be quite a thing at a point when Darcy is still morally repugnant to her.

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Nancy Gish 
  To: [log in to unmask] 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 12:11 PM
  Subject: Re: OT Pride and Prejudice

  Dear Pete,

  But Charlotte did marry, even if she married a fool. The "universal" fact is really conditioned by the female need--in that society
  --to find a husband or be doomed to various forms of misery: maiden aunt, governess, fallen woman. I think it is really an ironic remark about the assumptions of all marriageable young women that any available bachelor with enough to provide has to be made to do his duty and support a wife. So the sad lot is what is available, and Elizabeth is one of those women who either get lucky or are the right sort. Charlotte is quite happy to evade as much of her husband as she can because she has a proper place and role in society, and she makes the very best of it, given that she is neither beautiful nor rich nor socially clever in Elizabeth's way, and so cannot expect a romantic choice. It is a strangely sad and yet understandable and even rational choice. And "rational" is what Austen goes for even when her lucky heroines can have both.

  >>> Peter Dillane <[log in to unmask]> 08/13/13 8:39 PM >>> 
  Thanks for the interesting reflection Carrol which I enjoyed. They are a sad 
  lot the men in this book. I wonder why more of the women don't take up 
  Charlotte Lucas' observation that she bears the solitude quite well 

  Cheers Pete 

  -----Original Message----- 
  From: T. S. Eliot Discussion forum. [mailto:[log in to unmask]] 

  On Behalf Of Carrol Cox 

  Sent: Wednesday, 14 August 2013 9:11 AM 
  To: [log in to unmask] 
  Subject: Re: prose poetry--new topic 

  Darcy admits that he can only, really, _be_ Darcy as the husband of 
  Elizabeth. To 
  be himself, he had to be completed: he was indeed in want of a wife, a 
  particular one