Eliot describes them as "hints and guesses."  Mystics would claim to "live" them, but I don't think Eliot ever makes that claim.  Also, since he says they are outside of time, they cannot be lived in time--only hinted at or guessed at.  The goal of the mystic is to experience while still on earth what is only known to others in the afterlife.  I don't claim to validate any of this; it is a "mystery" but fascinating.
Nancy

>>> Diana Manister <[log in to unmask]>04/15/10 12:18 PM >>>
Dear Nancy,

If the still point is momentarily sensed, then it's briefly lived, isn't it? As distinct from being thought.

Cheers,

Diana

Sent from my iPod

On Apr 15, 2010, at 11:19 AM, Nancy Gish <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Then I think there is not for Yeats or Eliot.  The separate entities remain; it is perception Yeats questions and Eliot's still point is outside time, only momentarily sensed but not lived.
Nancy

>>> Chokh Raj <[log in to unmask]>04/15/10 11:13 AM >>>
resolution -- if there was one
 
                           "O Presences
That passion, piety or affection knows,
And that all heavenly glory symbolise -
O self-born mockers of man's enterprise" --
 
"Labour is blossoming or dancing where
The body is not bruised to pleasure soul.
Nor beauty born out of its own despair,
Nor blear-eyed wisdom out of midnight oil.
O chestnut-tree, great-rooted blossomer,
Are you the leaf, the blossom or the bole?
O body swayed to music, O brightening glance,
How can we know the dancer from the dance?"
 
 - WB Yeats, 'Among School Children'
 
"Neither flesh nor fleshless" --
"at the still point, there the dance is" --
"you are the music / While the music lasts".
 
 - TS Eliot, 'Four Quartets'
 
Cheers,
 CR

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