And usually there is an agenda behind such
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 10:23
Subject: Re: Eliot's poetry: the medium
& the message
Actually, theories come and go, and I have never accepted this one.
I am really quite sure I am having them--all theorists to the contrary--I have
theory also and a no-doubt antiquated certainty that I exist. What "I"
am is another problem.
At one point I read a great deal about this, and I never found in any
philosophical or theoretical text any explanation for a residue of
agency. I can't be specific without going back to all that, but I never
feel bound by current theories. And none were, as far as I could tell,
complete or satisfying on this. Who or what even can claim that
experiences or thoughts occur? It is an endless cycle. What is the
origin or agency or whatever you choose that produced the claim below
that experience occurs?
Nancy>>> Diana Manister
<[log in to unmask]>01/11/10 10:24 AM >>>
It's so outré to talk about consciousness.
Neuroscience can't find it, philosophy can't describe it, or psychology
David Chalmers calls finding consciousness "the
hard problem." "Impossible" is a more fitting
Postmodern criticial theory deconstructs consciousness
as a function of language. I and You are discursive only, linguistic
Experiences occur, thoughts occur. That doesn't
mean anyone is having
> RE: Aristotle
-- the old mantra was time = the measure of motion
> but it only makes
sense that he understood motion as
> The thing
is, it doesn't matter how good the measurement is,
> or how independent
of the observer it is, if some kind of
> result, however accurate or
misperceived, doesn't get through
> to some consciousness connected to
the measuring, then of
> what use or abuse is it?
Today, given current technology, it takes about a year to get to Mars.
Given a new Canadian invention which has a way of heating the
plasma [layman's terms] to unheard of degrees, it will take only
> Where is consciousness in relation to the result, not
to mention the
> development of those technologies?
be conscious is not to be in time"
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jonathan Crowther"
<[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sunday, January 10, 2010 5:59 AM
> Subject: Re: Eliot's poetry: the
medium & the message
> > Peter
> > For Aristotle doesn't motion = change rather than only
> > locomotion?
> > I understand
that the quantum effects of measurement / observation work
> > a measuring device which is only conscious in the sense of
> > by a consciousness? So separate in one
sense (physically) but not in
> > another (causally): an unseen
> > Jonathan
> > From: T. S. Eliot Discussion forum.
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf
> > Of Peter
> > Sent: 06 January 2010 22:43
> > To:
[log in to unmask]
> > Subject: Re: Eliot's poetry: the medium &
> > I think Aristotle said time is the
measure of motion.
> > For me, time is the measure of change.
> > Does measurement exist separate from the consciousness that
> > P.
> > ----- Original Message
> > From: "Chokh Raj" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010
> > Subject: Re: Eliot's poetry: the medium & the
> > For
"only in time can the moment in the rose-garden,
> > The moment in
the arbour where the rain beat,
> > The moment in the draughty church
> > Be remembered; involved with past and
> > Only through time time is conquered."
> > CR
> > --- On Sat,
1/2/10, Chokh Raj <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > > I for one never cease to enjoy Eliot's "world
> > of eye and ear",
> > > both for "what they half create,
/ And what
> > > perceive" --
> > > well pleased to
recognise in his "language of the
> > > sense",
> > >
the "anchor of my purest thoughts".
Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection. Sign up