There is clearly no point in discussing this because there is too much history to address. Gaza was isolated and poor before they elected Hamas. My only real point is that mocking Europe over a Black president has nothing to do with either this or any attitudes any European may have about the US. They are hardly more false than the absurd views Americans cherish about the French. Nancy >>> Kate Troy <[log in to unmask]>01/18/09 6:59 PM >>> Gaza is isolated and poor because the people elected a terrorist government. Even the Europeans refused to give them aid after they elected Hamas and for the French to declare a government as terrorist, you know that it must be true. For this all to stop, only one thing needs to happen. Hamas has to stop firing missiles at Israel and declaring that they want to destroy Israel, that this is the point of living for them. They would still have economic problems, but if they stopped firing missiles, Israel would stop retaliating and they could work on creating an economy, In a message dated 1/18/2009 6:34:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [log in to unmask] writes: Nothing is so simple as a good side and an evil side. Gaza has been cut off, denied hospital care and all medical supplies, frankly massacred. It is not a matter of a Hamas history of violence against an innocent Israel but of massive suffering in Gaza also, and right now what is happening is hellish. Nancy >>> Kate Troy <[log in to unmask]>01/18/09 6:18 PM >>> It's not just the 13 soldiers, Nancy, but the 20 Israeli teenagers in the pizza parlor who Carrol refused to acknowledge and the hundreds of other victims in Israel of Suicide bombers. In a message dated 1/18/2009 6:09:53 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [log in to unmask] writes: That there are two sides to every story-- if between only two positions/ there may be any number of sides--does not mean that both are right or even equally valid or both ok in any sense. The Hamas missiles are undoubtably wrong, but the utter disproportion between 1000 (mostly civilian, largely women and children) dead in an area where there is no place to escape and 13 soldiers is grotesque and no longer an issue of who was right or wrong first. Nancy >>> Kate Troy <[log in to unmask]>01/18/09 5:52 PM >>> I can't believe that you truly believe that there is only one side. In every conflict, in every divorce, in every fight between friends in a bar, there are two sides, even when one of those friends is 6'2 and the other 5'8, when the 5'8 man kicks the 6'2 man in the balls and the 6'2 man retaliates by punching him in the head to the floor.You need to open your mind and in this case, you need to read a book. It's called Exodus by Leon Uris. In a message dated 1/18/2009 5:40:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [log in to unmask] writes: > Kate Troy wrote: > > Carrol, It's just too one sided. Some things have only one side, and to even suggest that there are "two sides" to this ongoing massacre is very nearly a war crime in itself. Carrol See yours in just 2 easy steps! See yours in just 2 easy steps! See yours in just 2 easy steps!