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Rick, are you talking about the Teutonic Knights vs Alexander Nevsky (battle
of the ice etc)?  I thought that was a plain-out invasion, a pseudo-crusade
to force the Russian Orthodox Christians to convert to Roman Catholicism.  I
also thought that the German Baltic states were much more recent, just in
the past 2 or 3 centuries (maybe something from Peter the Great's time).

Robert Meyer


-----Original Message-----
From: Rickard A. Parker [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 1:48 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Lithuanians, Prussians, Russians, Germans and a fish called
Wanda


Carrol Cox wrote:
> There are German speaking areas in Russia, though I don't know remember
> now where they are or how they got there. And I have at least a vague
> memory that they do speak an earlier (hence "pure") form of German. It
> is quite possible that there has been a German-speaking community in
> Lithuania for centuries, though I don't know where to check on that
> possibility.

This morning I was checking up on Lithuanian history on the web.  I
didn't find what I was looking for but I suspect that it is because it
isn't on the web rather than it didn't happen.  I know that there were
German enclaves in Russia right up to WWII and they may still be
there.  Most were along the Volga as I remember.  Anyway, here is a
synopsis of what I found: I suspected that there were early German
enclaves in the Lithuanian area and I found enough to keep hope alive
but not enough to confirm it.  Lithuania was not only conquered by
Germans and Russians but also by Poles (and Ukaranians too?)  On the
other hand, they also had periods where they expanded into the lands
of the same.  The Lithuanians were among the last pagans in Europe.
Around 1200 the German knights started to invade (possibly partly
because there were Germans in there???)  There was a seperate
nationality of Prussians in the area that got absorbed so that Prussia
then referred to a German area. Lithuanian is the closest language
to Sanskrit.

...

Regards,
    Rick Parker