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Rick:

One other thing I meant to include.

During Dante's (pilgrim) visit with them it is Paolo who weaps the entire
time, not Francesca.

Rick Seddon
McIntosh, NM, USA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Seddon" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2002 4:48 PM
Subject: Re: Thoughts on "La Figlia che Piange"


> Rick:
>
> Paolo Valesio on page 71 of his essay in Mandelbaum's Inferno commentary
> says;  "Dante wants to draw attention to the contagion of literature not
> only on the two readers Paolo and Francesca, but also on the vast
community
> (both synchronic and diachronic) of readers---what rhetoricians call the
> universal audience."
>
> Francesca and Paulo are involved in a flirtation.  They begin to read a
book
> and then they read no more that day.  In bursts Francesca's old man and
> kills them both.  Sounds like a scene a troubadour would have wanted.  Of
> course Bertran de Born. the greatest troubadour of all, is condemned to
the
> ninth pouch (?) of the Maleborge, the eighth circle, pretty far down.
>
> Francesca and Paolo are both only in circle 2 of Limbo.  They did not even
> cross the Styx into the city of Dis and true Hell.  In circle 2 they
barely
> sinned enough to get into the Inferno.  They are just beyond the part of
> Limbo which is Virgil's own home for eternity. The circle they are in is
for
> sins of incontinence.  Their punishment is exclusion from God's Grace.
>
> I think Marcia cuts through to the quick of the matter by refocusing the
> examination on the book.  It is the book which Francesca claims got her
> killed and into hell.  I would say think about the book and its
> implications.
>
> The two lovers will live eternity together as all lovers poetically want
and
> that perhaps is the cruelest punishment of all. :>) As myth tries to tell
us
> over and over; don't ask the Gods for something you can't afford to live
> with.  I don't understand your comment that they are separated.  Pinsky
> gives as lines 73-75 of canto 5 where Dante (pilgrim) first sees Francesca
> and Paolo:
>
> " 'Poet,' I told him, 'I would willingly
>         Speak with those two who move along together
>         And seem so light upon the wind.'  And he:"
>
> Francesca and Paolo are together for eternity.
>
> After I reread Valesio I might have more.
>
> Rick Seddon
> McIntosh, NM, USA
>
> Rick Parker said:
>
> > Possibly.  And possibly there was no hunt for a statue either.  But
> > note Steve's message about the reasonableness of an allusion.  If
> > there is an allusion to Dante, one to Eliot's favorites of Francesca
> > and Paolo seems to be a good one.  It deals with love and seperation
> > as, while they are together in hell, they are also forever apart from
> > one another.
> >
> > Talking about allusions and borrowing, do you agree with Singleton's
> > comment about Dante alluding to Virgil in the Francesca passage or do
> > you lean toward a borrowing or just a coincidence?
> >
>
>
>