Those are reactions I can understand.
Quoting "Loucks, James" <[log in to unmask]>:
> Interesting, Robert. I do recall that Sandburg had some nasty things to say
> about TSE, for the usual reason: he had turned his back on America. Frost had
> the same complaint, as did WC Williams (who thought TSE would contaminate the
> American public when he returned in 1932 to lecture in these parts). Stevens
> sedulously ignored TSE's work, lest any influence from that quarter should
> insinuate itself into his own work.. -- Jim
> James Loucks, Ph.D.
> Ohio State University-Newark
> 1179 University Dr.
> Newark, OH 43055-1797
> [log in to unmask]
> fax 740.366.5047
> From: T. S. Eliot Discussion forum. on behalf of robert meyer
> Sent: Sun 29-Jan-06 2:13 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Bleistein + Sandburg? (was: Rick's Bel Esprit campaign)
> Jim, after all the discussion of several years back, I never thought of
> Sandburg's poem "Chicago" (apparently published in 1916). A lot of images
> in it, from the first line ("Hog Butcher for the World") to "your painted
> women" (= "...blue-nailed...hand"?) to "Under the smoke, dust all over his
> mouth...Under the terrible burden of destiny, laughing..." (= "The smoky
> candle end of time / Declines."?), seem surprisingly enough to be echoed in
> the TSE poem.
> Robert Meyer
> > [Original Message]
> > From: Loucks, James <[log in to unmask]>
> > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > Date: 1/29/2006 7:53:56 AM
> > Subject: Re: Rick's Bel Esprit campaign
> > One reading might be: Bleistein ["leadstone" in German] is a (vulgar)
> American ("money in furs" would suggest St. Louis rather than Chicago, by
> the way) who is also a Semite (Jew) whose ancestors came from Vienna, which
> happens to have been virulently anti-Semitic in its past; hence he is a Jew
> of the diaspora, who has in effect "returned" to Europe as a rich
> capitalist in a capitalist city, Venice. Browning, in "A Toccata of
> Galuppi's" (set in Venice) mentions "Shylock's Bridge," and TSE alludes to
> that poem in his epigraph ("Dear dead women, with such hair too").
> Bleistein's cigar, obviously a phallic symbol, adds to the
> rich-capitalist-semite caricature. TSE deserves Anthony Julius's criticism
> for such blatant stereotyping (which one can see is equally raw form in
> Gatsby). -- Jim Loucks
> > James Loucks, Ph.D.
> > Ohio State University-Newark
> > From: T. S. Eliot Discussion forum. on behalf of Tom Colket
> > Sent: Sun 29-Jan-06 10:18 AM
> > Subject: Rick's Bel Esprit campaign
> > >>Maybe we listers ought to start a TSE subscription charge in the
> > >>manner of Pound's Bel Esprit campaign to compensate Debra for
> > >>a weekly posting on some Eliotic matter. ;-)
> > >>
> > >>Regards,
> > >> Rick Parker
> > >
> > >Nice idea, but I couldn't take the pressure.
> > >
> > >Debra
> > That's too bad. Perhaps you'll reconsider if we raise enough cash.
> > By the way, if a weekly posting is too much, I'd greatly appreciate some
> > coherent explanation of the one line in an Eliot poem that I find the most
> > impenetrable:
> > Chicago Semite Viennesse.
> > Any thoughts?