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TSE  March 2001

TSE March 2001

Subject:

RE: OFF TOPIC - Literary parlor game

From:

"Arwin van Arum" <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:12:27 +0100

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Thanks. I've read enough of these philosophers and psychologists to last me
for a while - rather read the modern stuff. Just yesterday I read a
newspaper article about research which sheds completely new light on how
very young children behave just like scientists (the reverse has also been
mentioned). Particularly striking I think was that 18 month olds could
already distinguish between their own desires and those of others (whereas
14 month olds couldn't). Alison Gopnik, Berkeley, is the researcher
responsible and more popularly known (at least, that's what the article
says) through co-authoring the book "The Scientist in the Crib: How children
learn and what they tell us about the mind."

Had to read the Sartre in French, but it wasn't half bad - another book
where about 70 pages are spent on describing a woman on a veranda where
she's basically just whistling all the time was much worse (my memory must
have repressed the title). De Beauvoir was all over my mother's bookcase and
I read scraps and pieces of many of her books, but at that time wasn't up to
reading any of them in full. Sontag I read in university. The rest though
I'll keep in mind and take a look at.

I think my main problem is that I don't really know what I want. I'm in a
difficult position - on the one hand there's this practical person inside of
me, who needs to do something which is very much rooted in society; I have
to be part of the here and now, do something which affects the lives of
people today, and it has to be something banally useful. I found my place in
that regard as a programmer, at least for now. But on the other hand there
is a creative urge that needs to be released early and often; when I don't
for a while I don't feel completely alive. If I give either priority I've
descovered this will lead me to depression, so I have to find a balance
between the two. I have found a bit of balance in music, but a big part of
my true love is in language, and it has been seriously awakened by going to
Ireland and Scotland. I think I inadvertently reawakened the writer in me,
although I don't really feel ready to write because I feel I need more
experience, I need to be more alive ("Need more input" - Johnny Five). Then
again, the reader in me needs a context, and my novel does, I think, provide
the right context.

I still have this language crisis though. This list is often the only part
of my life that keeps me actively involved with the English language. On the
one hand it is my language of preference, as it has shaped the artistic me
and I lived in it throughout my student days; yet the Dutch language is the
language I hear every day, the language I can study in great and subtle
detail by listening people use it in every possible situation. It is very
hard to write a modern novel without being in direct contact with the spoken
language, and now my only options are to write either a novel in completely
colourless British or American accents, or not write in English at all. It
is a true dilemma.

I think you already told me just to write in English before, and perhaps
that's still the best option. I should write the story perhaps without to
much regard for the actual language at first, as it is (in a novel)
ultimately secondary to the story; or at least in terms of construction -
the story is what gives the language a backbone. Or perhaps I can use
foreign accents ... ;-)

Has anyone seen Buffy the Vampire Slayer incidentally? Contrary to what you
might believe it is really a book-person's series, full of lovely irony and
reference, and despite it's Gothicism very much rooted in today's society. I
feel very much at home watching it and love every minute. I bought the first
season on DVD (12 episodes x 45 min. for about $60, no commercials - though
I mostly followed the series on BBC which also doesn't have them) - it's the
first series ever I found worth buying, in which it beats even Star Trek TNG
and Lois & Clark, series which I loved to watch. But Buffy is really
something else - and that it's on DVD helps too, because you can go to any
point in any episode in an instant, which makes it more like a book than
ever before.

If you have a DVD, buy it and watch all twelve episodes. If you weren't
pleased, I'll give you your money back. ;-)

I think perhaps I just need to be in love ...

Arwin

  Kazanzakis (novels), Buckminster Fuller, de Rougemont (Love in the Western
  World), Maritain, Focillon,  Bertrand Russell, Wittgenstein's Blue Book
and
  Brown Book, Mario Praz (Mnemosyne), Goethe's Farbenlehre (for the
scientist
  in you), Paul Celan (poems), Isaac Rosenberg (poems), Sartre) No Exit),
  Simone de Beauvoir (The Second Sex), Wiesel (Night), Edwin Abbott
  (Flatland), Rudy Rucker (The Fourth Dimension), Martin Gardner (The
  Ambidextrous Universe), Sutton (The Particle Connection), Robert Jastrow
(The
  Enchanted Loom), Susan Sontag (Against Interpretation), Harold Bloom (The
  Book of J), Freud (Jokes and Their Relation to the Unconscious), Jung's
  Introduction to the I Ching, ...plus anything on the history of art, and
not
  just western art. Then go back and focus on the Dadaists and Surrealists,
and
  get a subscription to Leonardo Magazine (art and technology).

  pat





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<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001>Thanks. I've read enough of these =
philosophers and=20
psychologists to last me for a while - rather read the modern stuff. =
<FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D819455810-11032001>Just yesterday I=20
read a newspaper article about research which sheds completely new light =
on how=20
very young children behave just like scientists (the reverse has also =
been=20
mentioned). Particularly striking I think was that 18 month olds could =
already=20
distinguish between their own desires and those of others (whereas 14 =
month olds=20
couldn't). Alison Gopnik, Berkeley, is the researcher responsible and =
more=20
popularly known (at least, that's what the article says) through =
co-authoring=20
the book "The Scientist in the Crib: How children learn and what they =
tell us=20
about the mind." </SPAN></FONT></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D819455810-11032001>Had to=20
read the Sartre in French, but it wasn't half bad - another book where =
about 70=20
pages are spent on describing a woman on a veranda where she's basically =
just=20
whistling all the time was much worse (my memory must have repressed the =
title).=20
De Beauvoir was all over my mother's bookcase and I read scraps and =
pieces of=20
many of her books, but at that time wasn't up to reading any of them in =
full.=20
Sontag I read in university. The rest though I'll keep in mind and take =
a look=20
at. </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D819455810-11032001>I=20
think my main problem is that I don't really know what I want. I'm in a=20
difficult position - on the one hand there's this practical person =
inside of me,=20
who needs to do something which is very much rooted in society; I have =
to be=20
part of the here and now, do something which affects the lives of people =
today,=20
and it has to be something banally useful. I found my place in that =
regard as a=20
programmer, at least for now. But on the other hand there is a creative =
urge=20
that needs to be released early and often; when I don't for a while I =
don't feel=20
completely alive. If I give either priority I've descovered this will =
lead me to=20
depression, so I have to find a balance between the two. I have found a =
bit of=20
balance in music, but a big part of my true love is in language, and it =
has been=20
seriously awakened by going to Ireland and Scotland. I think I =
inadvertently=20
reawakened the writer in me, although I don't really feel ready to write =
because=20
I feel I need more experience, I need to be more alive ("Need more =
input" -=20
Johnny Five). Then again, the reader in me needs&nbsp;a context, and my =
novel=20
does, I think, provide the right context. </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D819455810-11032001>I=20
still have this language crisis though. This list is often the only part =
of my=20
life that keeps me actively involved with the English language.&nbsp;On =
the one=20
hand it is my language of preference, as it has shaped the artistic me =
and I=20
lived in it throughout my student days; yet the Dutch language is the =
language I=20
hear every day, the language I can study in great and subtle detail by =
listening=20
people use it in every possible situation. It is very hard to write a =
modern=20
novel without being in direct contact with the spoken language, and now =
my only=20
options are to write either a novel in completely colourless British or =
American=20
accents, or not write in English at all. It is a true dilemma.=20
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D819455810-11032001>I=20
think you already told me just to write in English before, and perhaps =
that's=20
still the best option. I should write the story perhaps without to much =
regard=20
for the actual language at first, as it is (in a novel) ultimately =
secondary to=20
the story; or at least in terms of construction - the story is what =
gives the=20
language a backbone. Or perhaps I can use foreign accents ...=20
;-)</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D819455810-11032001>Has=20
anyone seen Buffy the Vampire Slayer incidentally? Contrary to what you =
might=20
believe it is really a book-person's series, full of lovely irony and =
reference,=20
and despite it's Gothicism very much rooted in today's society. I feel =
very much=20
at home watching it and love every minute. I bought the&nbsp;first =
season on DVD=20
(12 episodes x 45 min. for about $60, no commercials - though I mostly =
followed=20
the series on BBC which also doesn't have them) - it's the first=20
series&nbsp;ever I found worth buying, in which it beats even Star Trek =
TNG and=20
Lois&nbsp;&amp; Clark, series which I loved to watch. But&nbsp;Buffy is =
really=20
something else - and that it's on DVD helps too, because you can go to =
any point=20
in any episode in an instant, which makes it more like a book than ever=20
before.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D819455810-11032001>If you=20
have a DVD, buy it and watch all twelve episodes. If you weren't =
pleased, I'll=20
give you your money back. ;-)</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D819455810-11032001>I=20
think perhaps I just need to be in love ... </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001>Arwin</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D819455810-11032001></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: =
5px"><FONT=20
  face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"Arial Narrow" =
lang=3D0 size=3D3=20
  FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF"><B>Kazanzakis (novels), Buckminster Fuller, de =
Rougemont=20
  (Love in the Western <BR>World), Maritain, Focillon, &nbsp;Bertrand =
Russell,=20
  Wittgenstein's Blue Book and <BR>Brown Book, Mario Praz (Mnemosyne), =
Goethe's=20
  Farbenlehre (for the scientist <BR>in you), Paul Celan (poems), Isaac=20
  Rosenberg (poems), Sartre) No Exit), <BR>Simone de Beauvoir (The =
Second Sex),=20
  Wiesel (Night), Edwin Abbott &nbsp; <BR>(Flatland), Rudy Rucker (The =
Fourth=20
  Dimension), Martin Gardner (The <BR>Ambidextrous Universe), Sutton =
(The=20
  Particle Connection), Robert Jastrow (The <BR>Enchanted Loom), Susan =
Sontag=20
  (Against Interpretation), Harold Bloom (The <BR>Book of J), Freud =
(Jokes and=20
  Their Relation to the Unconscious), Jung's <BR>Introduction to the I =
Ching,=20
  ...plus anything on the history of art, and not <BR>just western art. =
Then go=20
  back and focus on the Dadaists and Surrealists, and <BR>get a =
subscription to=20
  Leonardo Magazine (art and technology). <BR><BR>pat=20
<BR><BR><BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></B></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C0AA2C.EBD54740--

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